tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post5308498777129661635..comments2023-10-20T01:45:56.058-07:00Comments on Something Brilliant is Brewing: A 12 step apologeticLesliehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12401609334253676307noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-28886275919253339392012-05-12T18:29:52.525-07:002012-05-12T18:29:52.525-07:00I must be very blessed to live where I do (and whe...I must be very blessed to live where I do (and where I used to live, too). In any 12 step meetings I have attended for food addiction over the last 6 years there have never been any requirements or statements about what I could or could not have by anyone other than myself. Early on it was suggested to me to run from anyone who told me what I MUST DO when I have not asked. Only I can decide if I am free of the obsession - no one else. In every place there are people who are human and some people will develop he attitude that they know better or best over the others. That is their problem. If I am judging others it is my problem. At least, that has been my experience. What I eat or don't eat, what I do with a scale or a food plan - none of those are the point. It is not for everyone but neither is everyone's experience the same. However 12 step meetings that call themselves HOW or gray sheet - they are the nazis of food plans and judgement. They scare me - yet there are people who are happy with that. I cannot judge them either. But I can admit they scare me and stay away from their particular meetings. :-)Jane Cartellihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00655507125048588634noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-24905551913479424582012-05-07T16:17:25.888-07:002012-05-07T16:17:25.888-07:00Thank you for your honesty and posting your though...Thank you for your honesty and posting your thoughts. I always learn so much from you. I continue to learn and figure out what is going to work for me long term. I am a work in progress and doing well right now and I hope and pray it continues.Tami@NutmegNotebookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03734911958992997465noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-11489463485892047622012-05-03T20:49:56.313-07:002012-05-03T20:49:56.313-07:00I really got your post. yes yes yes. I have been ...I really got your post. yes yes yes. I have been in and out of OA. Initially, when I was in my late 20's and early 30's it made a big difference for me and I went probably 3 or 4 times a week for over a year. I developed a group of friends in the program, went to frequent meetings, had support systems, shared at meetings. There were always things that just didn't feel right to me and I always had to "spit out the bones" of so many things that I heard or read in meetings. <br /><br /> When I've tried OA off and on over the years since it has never really stuck. Something about the fact that many of the members had been abstinent for 5 or 10 years yet were super morbidly obese, just didn't make sense to me. I could say more but you said it already and better in your post.PJ Geekhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16550278783075004470noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-11607180871369132712012-05-03T16:46:57.783-07:002012-05-03T16:46:57.783-07:00This is a great post...and I can relate very much ...This is a great post...and I can relate very much to what Shelly said in her comment. I also wonder if there's a difference because in AA you stop drinking alcohol but with OA you can't stop eating...but I guess you could say that you stop eating some very specific foods. But you can't say, for example, "I will never eat sugar again" because that would be close to impossible. I know for me, the minute someone says, "you can't have that" (even if it's me saying it), the minute I say, "F you...I'm having it."<br /><br />I am going to be asking Diane my own set of questions, as I was also sent a copy of her book. Mine will be a bit different from the other Karen's :-)~Karen C.L. Anderson~https://www.blogger.com/profile/12079770255834481857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-53466992186826446282012-05-03T08:44:58.336-07:002012-05-03T08:44:58.336-07:00I wandered over here based on a comment you made o...I wandered over here based on a comment you made on Waisting Time's current post. I'm glad I did - I'll go read Diane's and Cammy's posts but I enjoyed your post because of its blunt honesty. <br /><br />One of the things you said that hit me: "...(I) lost weight. Because I stopped overeating. Not because of loving support, working the steps, following a magic food plan. Simply because I stopped what I was doing that made me gain weight in the first place." Do you realize how profound that paragraph is?<br /><br />A year or so ago I had the epiphany that the only reason EVERY program I "tried" & failed at failed simply because I quit doing it or began finagling and changing the program. Everytime. Something would happen (i.e., someone's birthday, dinner out, a binge, etc.) and I'd slowly give up and quit.<br /><br />I found a program awhile back, Burn the Fat, Feed the Muscle, that you download the ebook, blah blah - but his first chapter deals with something I found vital - the words of our mouth. If we keep saying "I can't" or "it doesn't work for me" or "I always blow it" - we will be manifesting self-fulfilling prophecies. Our words dictate our actions.<br /><br />He believes strongly that our words need to be positive, never negative. He states that we will talk ourselves right out of success and that no program will work until we get that down, anc that it is important to not talk our failures. And he has a website full of successful people. <br /><br />Of course I have the "talk" part down - I just need to get onto the "walk" or doing part! <br /><br />So LONG comment shortened (ha) - reading your post today really helped me and I am going to get off my bootie and go sweat to the oldies today and get back up on my weight loss wagon. To just do what I know to do.LBDDiarieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12095130599361379113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-75135722430983904802012-05-03T07:20:33.243-07:002012-05-03T07:20:33.243-07:00First, thanks for the mention and I'm glad tha...First, thanks for the mention and I'm glad that the post was thought-provoking for you. <br /><br />Second, I am sure Diane would be very happy to "talk" with you:) <br /><br />Now, moving on...<br /><br />Do you read Cammy's blog? I was struck when I read Diane's book and her responses to my questions with how similar the two are in their approaches. Cammy has described her approach as "beginning at the end." My words - both women took a long-term perspective on what they could eat for the rest of their lives, as opposed to what they could (or couldn't) eat short term to get to a goal. And both seem to have found success not only with that approach to losing, but maybe more importantly for me personally as a yo-yo dieter, to maintaining. Their paradigm is different, IMO, from that of many classic dieters. <br /><br />As for the food addiction, this is something that I wonder about a lot, with all my struggles in the past years, with what I know happens when I eat certain foods like bread, from what I've read on your blog that rings so similar for me. I don't know if I am a food addict, but I do think that I have become "disordered" with eating or my relationship with food, probably brought on by myself with all my years of yo-yo dieting.<br /><br />Where am I going with this long ramble. I have no idea! Sorry. But I do think there is a lot we can learn from the experience and wisdom of others and that also, one size does NOT fit all with dieting/maintaining as with all things. So what works for someone one necessarily work for us. Be it OA or calorie counting or low-carb or whatever. Wish this wasn't so darn hard!Karenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15086719828916510651noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-78534160447576871052012-05-03T04:24:46.001-07:002012-05-03T04:24:46.001-07:00Diane always seems like someone who just got carri...Diane always seems like someone who just got carried away with food, someone who had a minor weight problem (to read her) but not a food addiction/eating disorders problem. <br /><br />But I agree her highest weight/the amount of weight she lost belies that. She is a tried and true because of her duration and also her pregnancies during maintenance. <br /><br />I love definitions:<br />be·lie (b-l)<br />tr.v. be·lied, be·ly·ing, be·lies<br />1. To give a false representation to; misrepresent: "He spoke roughly in order to belie his air of gentility" (James Joyce).<br />2. To show to be false; contradict: Their laughter belied their outward grief.<br /><br />I have been to OA meetings. Food was NEVER discussed in any way. Plans were never discussed in any way. Are you talking about what goes on after/outside the meetings or during the meetings? I did not have a sponsor, just went to see because Frances had talked so much about that time of thing in Passing for Thin. And to be very honest, the people at the local meetings were maintaining at a higher weight than my starting weight. So it was not a good fit for me. But it was interesting.Vickiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05452333714845476967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-91897757962557345212012-05-02T19:22:24.897-07:002012-05-02T19:22:24.897-07:00I am also a 12-step food program drop out. I trie...I am also a 12-step food program drop out. I tried--I really did, but in my heart, I knew it wasn't for me. Like you, I didn't really want what they had. It seemed like a prison of sorts, and the judgment, the slogans, the shaming all went against my grain. I also can't bring myself to drag my food scale to restaurants and banquets to weigh my food, nor do I think it is necessary. <br /><br />I guess we're all different, and what works for one, may not work for others--and that is OK. But like many OA HOW dropouts, I have had a hard time moving completely away from the program. From time to time, I still get the idea that I should be able to live like that--even when the truth is that I can't. One of my goals is to understand that I can't be a member of such a group. I really wish that I would have never been a member, because I think it has held me back in my quest for weight loss. I'm getting closer to breaking completely away, but like a bad penny, those OA HOW thoughts pop up from time to time, and if I try it, I always fail. Thanks for writing this.E. Janehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04079110676794095541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-60834570352566504522012-05-02T15:27:13.206-07:002012-05-02T15:27:13.206-07:00My very good friend has been in FA for over a year...My very good friend has been in FA for over a year now, and has done wonderfully. But every time she tells me about the program and the requirements, I start to bristle and seethe...and I think you hit the nail on the head - it's the judgement that comes along with it. There is no judgement in AA (well, there can be, but it's not condoned like it is in FA). I have been quite proud of myself in that I was able to tell my friend that while I was happy the program worked for her, it wasn't for me, and mean it. I think you absolutely know what does not work for you - and that's a huge part of this process. Now just to figure out what DOES work. You're getting there, though - I can see it happening.Shelleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09268130692900152965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-60169767055837068962012-05-02T13:15:09.897-07:002012-05-02T13:15:09.897-07:00That is a very excellent analysis of your own need...That is a very excellent analysis of your own needs and desires in a program. I like to think of each program that doesn't work for me as information gained - now I know what DOESN'T work! <br />Best of luck in your journey!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9172726268459163555.post-83201958524177005522012-05-02T12:45:50.055-07:002012-05-02T12:45:50.055-07:00Hi Leslie! Well, I do understand what you're s...Hi Leslie! Well, I do understand what you're saying. If a person hates the group for some reason, that's never going to work well. <br /><br />I hated WW's point system. Also, they always talked to me about responsibility. I don't hate responsibility itself, I just hate the idea of it shoved down my throat. <br /><br />I'm in TOPS now. No prescribed diet. No forced food exclusions. You're supposed to come up with your own solution. We spend more time chatting about what is working or not working for members than anything else. I like the people. <br /><br />So I there are kindly people somewhere in a weight management group for you. There was for me. <br /><br />:-) MarionAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09499442282999349686noreply@blogger.com